exercising the mind - free shaping

[Gracie]

how do i freeshape gracie to tough object with back paw?
front paws, ans mouth, and sweaking the ball are no probs, but trying to get her to touch, put back foot in a ring?? help! she has only offered the behaviour once, which i clicked, and my clicking is getting good to!! clicked as her foot was on the ring, but she never put the two together back foot got the click!
so any ideas how i can get this one or is it just case of waiting it out! because she would need to put her back foot on lots of times in a row before i  can stop clicking the from paws?

also now with freeshaping she keep focused on me, she doesnt go off chasing flies or generally mess about, so am thinking maybe getting too easy, so i put down 3 objects, 2 balls diff colours and a teddy, wanted to touch green ball, she did well, then tested with blue ball, then went back to green. we only managed about 5 mins of this maybe not even that long - had to do some close recalls, to keep focus, and then she went back to green ball hugh bingo, well done etc, and i left it at that!
am i going to fast? not planning on doing multiple abjects all the time, but just to get her really thinking!

[kizkiznobite]

thats sounds real good to me - with the back paws - start the free shaping rewards just by walking over it with the back legs - backing up etc then build it from there - it might be easier to do it with a larger item first such as a cushion then swop it to a ring so you get the touching something with the rear feet legs

[Gracie]

ahh ok thanks will give that a go!

so im not going to fast, as long as s top when she finding it too hard and finish on a good note!?

[kizkiznobite]

nope just let her set the pace - when she had enough try for just the one more then stop.

[Gracie]

ok just have to share this!
put me 3 items down again, same 3, want her to touch green ball again! she touches blue ball no click, so she picks it up and tosses behind the tv! touches green ball - click reward for that!
then she touches tedd, no click reward so she picks that up and trows behind the sofa!!
is this a clever doggie ?!
well i thought so, had to laugh at her!

oh and re back paw, tried cushion, can i clickher for touching with front paw, toss treat out, as she goes to get treat if she touches with back paw can i click and throw another treat before she has got the first, or will this confuse? mind just thinking i might just be rewarding her for going to get 1st treat!!

[kizkiznobite]

hehe - an ami in the making  dont click her for front paws at all - just wait it out but the second she walks over it with back legs click and reward

[piglet]

Hi,

have you got "back" yet ?

it seems most obvious to me to get "back" first - alot of people do it down the side of sofa as its a narrow-ish gap for dog with wills he does walk back instead of turning round so i captured his naturally.

[kizkiznobite]

yep gracie got back - but while this would be easier way it better she freeshapes it

[GSPmad]

ok - have a question - if you are trying to freeshape with a ring to get dog to put paw in it and ring ends up getting knocked about around room and dog going to it so back is to you and you can't see whether they are putting paw in or not as you can't see through them.... what do you do? bearing in mind you keep getting up and moving ring back to where you can see it and it keeps migrating away again. 

[SuzAndTheDiva]

nail it to the floor   

[kizkiznobite]

that tends to happen when the click has not been done at the correct time at the start of the free shape exercise - at the stage when the dog just looks at it

[GSPmad]

that tends to happen when the click has not been done at the correct time at the start of the free shape exercise - at the stage when the dog just looks at it

i did - or i thought i did. 

so what do i do now then?

[kizkiznobite]

start again  put the ring near your feet - at first glance throw the treat out - when dog comes back looking at ring click and throw out the treat before reaching - remember if dog is working fast it the delivery of the treat that slows them down - dog will stop and look on the click for where the treat is going

[GSPmad]

not getting chance to put ring down before dog pounces on it  - should i throw treats out for them to get while i put ring down to get chance to get back to where dog might glance at ring instead of leaping on it?  if you see what i mean.

[kizkiznobite]

yep - when setting up a freeshape with fast dogs then you need to get dog out of face - theother thing is you could do the same thing with another article - like a heavy book - then transfer